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July 14, 2008

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Dan

Mary, I appreciate your effort to be charitable by assuming that Adam Cohen is “unwilling” to comprehend such a simple concept, rather than obtuse. I cannot (or will not) be so charitable. I believe Cohen is obtuse. I doubt that he is obtuse in the sense of being able to grasp simple, and even complex, concepts that are widely accepted by his society (e.g. certain mathematical or linguistic concepts), but he is obtuse in the sense that he is unable to penetrate or think past his cultural prejudices and analyze the issue (or perhaps any ethical issue) with intellectual and emotional honesty.

Cohen’s obtuseness is unfortunately quite common among human apes (Contrary to what Cohen implies, we’re not demi-gods; we’re apes). Humans are generally heavily conditioned and habitual when it comes to thinking about anything, but this is especially true in areas like morality. Arthur Schopenhauer believed, and I agree with him on this, that there are three reasons why the vast majority of people behave morally: 1) the need for social approval; 2) fear of legal consequences; and 3) fear of religious/superstitious consequences. The remaining small percentage of humans behave morally out of genuine empathy and perhaps a sense of justice. This might explain why so few people are morally outraged by our behavior toward nonhumans.

Mary Martin

Dan,
I guess being kind (if you can even call it that, at this point) to Cohen is due to me reminding myself that for 15 years I ate the flesh of sentient nonhumans, and then for a subsequent 20 years I gave loads of cash to PeTA (though in my defense at the beginning they really were an animal rights organization), and thereafter I touted free-range cow flesh as an alternative (you know, if you must eat parts of others) to factory-farmed cows. In other words, I was just as hypocritical, misinformed and dim-witted as Cohen sounds.

Maybe it's a Buddhist influence. Though it's easy to see how we're different from each other (when that's convenient), sometimes we don't like to look at the ways we're mirrors for each other. Whenever I have the urge to insult someone, I think: Okay, this person and this situation is in front of me for a reason. What am I supposed to learn? How might I bring compassion to this situation?

Oh, and sometimes a cigar is just a cigar . . .

And all this, coming from a person more comfortable with the militant behavior of other ARAs than most vegans.

Go figure.

Dan

I think the main difference between Cohen and, say, pre-vegan me, is that I never wrote about or criticized animal rights or other things that I hadn’t give much thought about. In fact, when I read the rationale for animal rights for the first time, it made complete sense to me, and I went vegan – virtually immediately. What I did NOT do was write about it in a bad light (“easy to mock”) or report on it giving the pros and cons from the fence. So, I don’t consider myself a mirror of Cohen, and, as much as it is possible for Cohen and I to have something in common, I do think that people are very often genuinely and profoundly different from one another.

Anyway, my point was to criticize Cohen, who, if he is going to write about AR, ought to research it sufficiently to give it due respect (which is more respect than he gave it). My point in bringing up human moral behavior in general was to address your comment about so few of us having moral outrage with regard to how animals are used and abused – I don’t think we evolved to have much more outrage over it than the other Great Apes.

Mary Martin

Dan,
The mirror doesn't imply there can't be profound differences, only that I try to see how we might be similar (and sometimes we're really not and I see your point here for you. Cohen and I might have a similarity where you don't.).

Since I read the NYT first thing every day and often get my material from it (it's become a sport, though I'm worried that it's not that challenging), I am compiling a list for the editors and writing to them regarding the consistent misinterpretation of animal rights by its writers and the perpetual lack of research demonstrated in its articles.

And I do plan to mention the lack of moral outrage, in addition to the mockery of those of us who are outraged. It's an odd thing, to ridicule others for having a moral code that makes perfect sense, is based in both logic and compassion, and aims to decrease exploitation and suffering, isn't it?

Nick

I couldn't even finish reading this post. Why is the New York Times always so incredibly hostile to animal rights and veganism? It makes me so angry.

Dan

It most certainly is an odd thing (from a rational and empathetic standpoint) to ridicule a moral code that is compassionate and logically consistent with such basic notions as the golden rule, and it shows just how much of a “herd thing” morality is for most people.

I’m glad that you’re compiling that list of poorly researched, ignorant, and biased animal rights journalism of the NYT as well as lack of moral outrage and the mockery of moral outrage. I hope it can pry open some minds there.

Mike Grieco

Hi Mary, Cohen's article was published in yesterdays Yukon News.
Thanks for decontructing it. People here also have much to learn and understand when it comes to "animal rights". Then again, many people here do not want to support the rights of animals, after all, it will mean we can't take "their" lives from them if we give "them" rights.

Keep well.

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